Author Topic: Major fight  (Read 710 times)

jennyb

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Major fight
« on: October 28, 2011, 01:50:13 AM »
Hi,

I didn't know what to put for topic title, i know there isn't much help for this so i wanted to post just because i wanted to talk to someone i've had a terrible scare.

My Chippies since building the new aviaries have been getting on quite alright. I only had problems with Hermione bullying Asriel she wasn't letting him get some food even though i put more than one bowl in she went to each taking the best bits and she bit him on his tail twice, nose and ears, minor injuries but to give him peace i separated them. There is also trouble in Nutkin's aviary her daughter Millie now living with her dad Ronald-Harry is bullying both her mum and dad but especially dad she is only 11 weeks old. So far no injuries.

The other groups have been more settled until yesterday. I hear terrible sounds of squealing and go into the garden and find Dobby (Lottie's son) injured, his front leg was covered in blood he was limping, i brought him inside. While setting up a cage for him more squealing, i go outside again and i find Blossom attacking Lottie, she had hold of her sister's front paw and again it was covered in blood so i ran into the aviary and she let go. I grabbed Blossom and put her in her own cage. Then Lottie came over limping and i was able to see her injury it looked bad much like Dobby. Then Mia (Lottie's daughter) and Isabella (Lottie's sister) appeared and both had also been bitten on a front paw but thankfully not like the other two, its very minor. I stayed with them and sprayed Rescue Remedy on them which i've heard is soothing for animals and Lottie's leg looked much better after it stopped bleeding and she wasn't limping so much. The aviary theres blood everywhere horrible sight. Blood in Isabella's fur. Only one with no injuries is Blossom. I still don't know what to make of this, it was like Blossom was possessed i mean she just wouldn't stop i felt she would of killed Dobby and probably Lottie aswell. I know Chipmunks can be aggressive but this was mad. I love all the Chipmunks and this was just so distressing  :'(
Asriel,Abi,Hermione,Lottie,Isabella, Willow,Nugget,Sandi,Amber Jr,Mia,Tiny,Scabbers,Millie, Ariana(Chipmunks), Elle, Minstrel & Jake (Cats).
 
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ilovechips

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Re: Major fight
« Reply #1 on: October 28, 2011, 02:27:30 AM »
aww jen that sounds mad  :-\

i wonder why it just suddenly erupted

jennyb

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Re: Major fight
« Reply #2 on: October 28, 2011, 02:54:21 AM »
aww jen that sounds mad  :-\

i wonder why it just suddenly erupted

I really have no idea. This was one of the most settled groups i have, the three Dilute sisters had a very close bond and all five got on well there was the odd squabble when one took food off another but nothing much and they all slept together and Blossom and Isabella even helped look after Lottie's babies. I don't know what to do.
Asriel,Abi,Hermione,Lottie,Isabella, Willow,Nugget,Sandi,Amber Jr,Mia,Tiny,Scabbers,Millie, Ariana(Chipmunks), Elle, Minstrel & Jake (Cats).
 
www.chirpiechipmunkz.webs.com

jennyb

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Re: Major fight
« Reply #3 on: October 28, 2011, 05:10:26 AM »
Pics of the completed aviaries
Asriel,Abi,Hermione,Lottie,Isabella, Willow,Nugget,Sandi,Amber Jr,Mia,Tiny,Scabbers,Millie, Ariana(Chipmunks), Elle, Minstrel & Jake (Cats).
 
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sab

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Re: Major fight
« Reply #4 on: October 28, 2011, 10:41:43 AM »
Hi Jenny,
i am so sorry to hear that.
I think you had a great idea to separate Blossom from the rest of the scurry.There is not much else to do.
I am not surprise than some fights are happening and it is all about food and territory for this winter.The chipmunks are getting very greedy and selfish.This is the storage process before hibernation that sometimes turn them into little devils.
I understand it is very upsetting.
Hope that things get better now that Blossom is out of the aviary.
Good luck!
 :)
I love my three babies so much.Yuki my male and Kimiko and Mayumi my two females sisters!!!  R.I.P. Aiko (20/04/2011-13/10/2011)
One Tropical Fish Tank and Forest my pooch!!!

tarcus/Kevin

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Re: Major fight
« Reply #5 on: October 28, 2011, 11:03:23 AM »
I have at times over the years had up to 20 individuals living together quite harmoniously in one enclosure without injuries to any. However the difference between my situation and your own is that I did not have so many related chips in with each other. I used to swap the babies with other breeders every spring and the colony was built up over 4 years to the maximum number. Nowadays I don't have as mush space and only keep a maximum of 6 in my aviary which is 15ft x 6ft x 6 ft and have no problems with any of them.
My thoughts are that perhaps(and I am no better at reading chipmunk thoughts than any other)being  related they have now become pissed off with living in each others pockets. This could be down to a feeling that the gene pool is too small or simply that they would prefer just to meet at weddings and funerals like a lot of human families.
When you look at all the factors which could start a fight for dominance which is after all survival of the species it is the hardiest and biggest who generally get to mate and produce offspring you appear to have quite a lot of jealousy going on (to put it in human terms) which is now turning into bullying.
As for "Why now" My suggestion would be that they can foresee a very harsh winter coming and despite out human efforts to supply enough food and shelter for all they do not see it that way all they see in their siblings/parents grandparents even is competition, they are not brothers and sisters any-more than you or I are related in their minds, they are individuals whose main priority is number one.
Many will come play with you and allow you to touch stroke or even carry them, this is fine but they are still playing the dominance game with you, they see a source of food so overcome their natural fear of another species in order to survive, those who are not so willing to come to you will be green with envy in human terms that they can not overcome their fears as well as the others and will resort to bully tactics to get what they want.
I know how much you love and care for each and every one of your babies but my only suggestion would be that you have a decisive turnover of individuals; if not now; then definitely in the spring before they begin breeding.
We all of us at time tend to make the mistake of thinking of pets are Humans with Human emotions and aspirations I don't know anyone who does not tell their pet dog or cat to ask mummy/daddy for a treat/walk but we must remember with smaller pets that they are wild animals and have primal instincts of survival which are far more ingrained than our own. They will fight and kill others to ensure their own survival no matter what we try to do there is no real way of reassuring them that everything will be fine during the next few months when their instincts are saying you must save/hoard/eat all the food available; regardless of how much there is you must have it all.
THESE are just my own psycho babble thoughts on the workings of a chipmunks brain I am sorry I am unable to say with any certainty that the squabbling will pass, or that by pairing "A" with"E" rather than "B" the situation would resolve itself.
It must ultimately be your decision as to how you resolve things but personally as much as I love each of my babies for their individual personality and charm should one or more decide they wanted their freedom from the group situation they are in I would swap/trade/sell them to another breeder/owner/carer rather than keep pandering to their demands for extra space.
I hope you are not offended by any of my thoughts but I only ever think about the welfare of the chipmunks in my care. Sometimes to the detriment of my own human family  :sign10:
I do hope though that things settle down at least for the winter. and each of your chips can go forward from this bad week.
CHIPMUNKS;LIKE ALL ANIMALS ARE FOR LIFE NOT JUST FOR FASHION STATUS.

mrchips

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Re: Major fight
« Reply #6 on: October 28, 2011, 01:48:17 PM »
and don't worry too much about the blood.  A very little blood goes a long way when it is in fur, on branches etc. 
I DON'T NEED ANGER MANAGEMENT - I NEED PEOPLE TO STOP PISSING ME OFF! :-)
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jennyb

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Re: Major fight
« Reply #7 on: October 28, 2011, 11:35:09 PM »
Thanks all for your replies

Tarcus i think you are onto something and no i'm not offended by your comments because what you are saying is true i do probably have too many animals and more importantly most of my Chippies are related animals. I was planning to separate the son from the daughter and the Dilute sisters in a few months time before they can breed next spring and same with other opposite sex related Chippies but i was leaving it until as late as i could because i hate to break up families and guess i've left it too long  :(  I've also just become so attached to certain individuals which is the main reason i've kept so many.

I will be honest i am able to look after all these Chippies but some days i do find caring for so many too much and i just can't spend so much time with them all as i would like.

Reducing the numbers will be very hard for me because i've developed a close relationship with many of these indiduals but like you say i need to consider what is best for my animals and maybe how i'm keeping them is not in their best interests. Out of the Dilute sisters Lottie is the one i'd most like to keep, Lottie almost died as a 3 week old so naturally i'm especially attached to her out of the four babies in the litter. If anyone could offer Blossom or maybe another a good home i would consider selling her/them but whoever has Blossom would need to be very understanding that she may not ever mix with another Chipmunk. Blossom is a nice girl surprisingly, she's so tame shes not shy at all and will jump on me and raid my pockets, she is one of my most tame.

It might be a good idea for Ronald-Harry to leave his the brother of the sisters and since i have Asriel the dad its probably best the son leaves. R-Harry is a character but he is not as tame as the sisters but he will come to me so with some time spent he'll make a great Chippie. He became a dad this Autumn with Nutkin, babies were healthy. He's a big Chippie, he loves his food so you'll need to watch for him getting fat, he does have a tendancy to put weight on.

I might also consider Dobby once he is recovered from his injuries. Isabella and Nutkin are another two i may rehome. I was planning to breed Millie in spring with a friend's male Chippie then keep a baby from that litter then rehome Millie because i wanted to put Millie's baby in the Cinnamon programme to introduce unrelated blood. I do want to continue with the Cinnamons and also keep my Cinn carrier Willow.

Sabine, I'm going to keep Blossom separated, not going to risk putting her back in.

Mrchips, thankfully the three Chippies still in the aviary much better today, Mia and Isabella you can hardly see their injuries, Lottie's injury is more noticable and she's a little bit tender with her paw but is using it and its not bleeding. I'm spraying saline onto the wounds. The Chippies were all active so looks like they had a lucky escape. With Dobby inside though things look not so good, he is still very traumatised by what happened and his paw looks the worst of the injuries and its swelling up now so is making it harder for him to hold his food and his paw looks red all the fur has gone so i am more worried about him. I'm keeping his wounds as clean as possible.
« Last Edit: October 29, 2011, 12:10:34 AM by jennyb »
Asriel,Abi,Hermione,Lottie,Isabella, Willow,Nugget,Sandi,Amber Jr,Mia,Tiny,Scabbers,Millie, Ariana(Chipmunks), Elle, Minstrel & Jake (Cats).
 
www.chirpiechipmunkz.webs.com

Nick

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Re: Major fight
« Reply #8 on: October 29, 2011, 11:42:41 AM »
I think someone needs a new keyboard!
Nick

Marci

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Re: Major fight
« Reply #9 on: November 01, 2011, 01:48:38 AM »
Tarcus - Great post about Chippie Psychology.  We need more of those!

Perhaps I can email you one day with my chipmunk pysch issues and you can offer me some good advice.

Jenny - Hang in there.  They are G-d's little creatures, ya know.

Buddy (RIP 1/10/12), Lilly, Remy and Martyn

adamclark18

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Re: Major fight
« Reply #10 on: November 01, 2011, 12:02:53 PM »
I'm reaching the end of my teather with one of mine chasing the other, they sleep happily in the same nest box but then 1 spends all day chasing the other, I think hes only bit him once on the ear, he can only same to escape by running in his wheel constantly. It's not fair to have a chipmunk constantly scared but I dunno what to do that's best for them

Marci

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Re: Major fight
« Reply #11 on: November 01, 2011, 12:51:06 PM »
i would separate them right away or you may end up with an injured or dead chipmunk.  Better safe than sorry.
Buddy (RIP 1/10/12), Lilly, Remy and Martyn

adamclark18

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Re: Major fight
« Reply #12 on: November 01, 2011, 01:59:56 PM »
I only have the 1 cage, and whos going to want to take on a badly behaved chipmunk

Nick

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Re: Major fight
« Reply #13 on: November 01, 2011, 02:32:59 PM »
mine are chasing each other at the moment, they were the same this time last year, but best of friends all through the summer........they'll just be trying to protect their food stores. I wouldn't worry unless they are tearing bits out of eacxh other
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adamclark18

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Re: Major fight
« Reply #14 on: November 01, 2011, 04:13:42 PM »
lol slightly conflicting opinions there, its def to do with his food storage, as soon as i put a fresh batch in he gets all the sunflower seeds and hides them straight away. Feel sorry for him as its all day long, he squells loudly too

ive uploaded a vid so hope this helps http://imageshack.us/clip/my-videos/153/s3n.mp4/